The Canon 5DSr – Their best yet – Part 1 A hands on practical review for wedding photography
The Canon 5DSr Wedding Photography review – Part 2
The 5DSr, a camera with short man syndrome and a shotgun[/caption]
As far as lenses go I was surprised with what I thought I’d see and what I actually got. Generally any Canon glass older than 5 years suffers a little. Yet, the 24L and 35L really shine at F2. The Sigma 50 Art is absolutely gorgeous except I don’t really use that focal length much and I’m hoping to get my hands on the newly announced 24-35 F2 zoom from Sigma. If it’s in line with their art series of glass we could be on to a win.
The 24-70mk II performs well as does the 70-200 F4, it actually focuses quicker on the 5DSr than it does on the 5D3. Take from that what you will.
This only happens to Canon users who don’t fixate on dynamic range
The worries about the high pixel density and the shutter speed = focal length are just that, worries. It’s not like the D800 where the images were slightly blurred, the 5DSr is a camera I can happy shoot without the worry of blurring. Generally I don’t shoot slower than 1/60 anyway so the only thing I need to step up for is my 85L, 135L and 200L. The rest either have image stability or are super wide.
The 35L loves this camera[/caption]
Now onto the not so great which are really more niggles that could be addressed with firmware updates of which I only have three:
1: Mraw is compressed raw. This has always been the case but really, give us some more file options please. DNG would be a good start. I want to shoot and know I have the full raw data to work with. There may well be a great reason at Canon for this but let us choose what we want to work with and also allow some of us to continue using Lightroom 5 (which actually works vs LRCC which doesn’t).
If I had uncompressed Mraw (28mp) then I’d replace my 5D3 with another 5DSr as let’s be honest, table shots, photos of the table plan and other stuff doesn’t warrant the resolution and I’m that guy who’ll forget he’s in Mraw and start shooting the couple shots and formals so I stick in full size raw and leave it at that.
Also, I’m swerving a little bit here but if you’re put off by the 50mp file size don’t be. Just edit as normal and store as lossy DNG’s when the edit is done. 128gb of CR2 files compresses to 15-55gb depending on the ISO’s used. You can’t really tell the difference either and it’s unlikely you’ll need them again anyway.
2: Please enable the same Register/recall shooting function (CF section 3 – Custom controls) as the 1DX, in the 1DX I can say that when I press the AF-on button it will jump into a shooting mode (like TV or AV) even if I’m in Manual mode. The way it’s set means that pressing the button will only use a setting for that mode.
I mean c’mon guys, where’s the option to jump into a shooting mode on the 5DSr?
It makes the feature pretty useless and can’t help but feel it’s crippled somehow. This feature was what spurred me to buy the 5DSr, the ease of use. So, Masaya Maeda, if you’re reading this could you please have this fixed?
- 3: Image view and zoom time. This kind of links to point number one. Whenever you look at a shot you’ve taken in the camera you are looking at the jpeg file that comes part and parcel with the raw file. If you’re used to using Perfect Browse or Photo Mechanic to sort your files before editing in Lightroom then you’ll know what I’m talking about.
The problem is that these appear to be full size super huge 50mp jpegs and this slows down the whole viewing and preview process. Zooming into these files is a bit slow. It’s not a serious problem as it’s not too slow, but how about Canon gives us the option on what file size is used for the jpeg preview contained in the raw. Like 12mp or something so we can check the focus quickly and go back to the shooting. I’m not overly fussed if this slows down the overall buffer unload time but I’d like to have that as a choice I make rather than it being forced upon me.
Other than that, no real issues. It’s a great camera and worth the money.
In comparison with other cameras and looking to the future….
It’s very difficult to not notice how far Sony have come with their sensor tech. I mean look at what they have now, it’s great. But it’s still consumer level. When I heard about the A7rii and after shooting with a second who had an A7s, A7ii and GH4 setup I bought an A7ii. It’s a really good camera, with professional quality photos but it’s still a consumer body which won’t last a season with me.
You can throw body stabilisation, tilt screen, wifi and so on at the A7 but it is most definitely not a pro level camera and shouldn’t be treated like one. If my Canon goes wrong it’s at CPS in Elstree and back in 4 days. I have pro features such as dual card slots for image security and this supercedes any features. (But a tilt screen and global shutter would be nice all the same).
by Chris Giles Photography
Sensor Shmensor
I also feel at this point now there isn’t a lot between sensors, I edited D750 and A7ii files and they are all pretty bad when pushed. You’ve 2-3 stops at best and that’s in line with the 5DSr. Things may fall about a bit in the higher ISO’s but that’s when photographic technique should overcome laziness.
The big brother of the A7ii, the A7rii sounds sexy on paper but again, it’s a consumer body with pro features so is discounted from the running. I’m almost tempted to get it for the true silent shutter but it’s a lot of money to pay for one feature on a camera with only a single card slot. That’s not knocking the A7 series either, great cameras if I was going on holiday but also Sony raws are compressed. Like, WTF Sony.
***Update 9th August 2015***
So I’ve had my hands on the A7rii files after shooting a wedding with a second photographer. The silent shutter is beautiful, but above ISO3200 the A7rii is about a stop worse in noise levels. What is acceptable ISO12800 on the Canon is unacceptable with the Sony. Correctly exposed ISO100 files are nice from both cameras but the 5DSr ones look more crisp and clear with the A7 files looking slightly warmer. Good files from both cameras nonetheless but the Canon definitely takes the lead in normal use image quality.
It’s also been pointed out that the A7rii only shoots in 12bit when using the silent shutter or bulb mode, stuff landscape shooters will tend to use for reduced shutter vibration……
Thinking forward to the next 5D if you scale down the current 5DSr tech from 50mp to 25mp in theory doubling the pixel size what kind of camera would you end up with and how fast would it shoot? Would you still need a Sony sensor in them because I really don’t think it’ll need it when reflecting on how good this sensor is. I don’t want my greens to look radioactive and Canon really does have the best colours.
I’d love something like a mini 1DX. In fact I’ll say it now, 18mp is enough, the sensor in the 1DX is great and good enough, it’s just missing a (truly) silent shutter and the body is too big and heavy for continuous all day shooting which is why the 5DSr is so attractive.
by Chris Giles Photography
The Elephant in the room is the Pentax 645z but I consider it a completely different class of camera. A body which costs 2-3 times as much as the 5DSr (depending on where you look) and not exactly the best service setup in the world. (Pentax France had a 300mm lens for three months and I got fed up waiting for service and asked for it back). That’s not very good if most of my work is between May and September. But, if you are looking for that larger sensor look and have the money then yes the Pentax is great but the 5DSr is snipping at it’s heals with it’s lens selection, price, resolution, colours and when shooting at ISO100 there’s not much difference.
It’s all blaaaack
But the histogram isn’t clipping
Here it is +4 Stops in Lightroom
Sure there are guys who will pull out MTF charts, quote DXOmark and do 100% pixel peeping but really it’s not that important. If we are serving clients, couples and people who want their lives and loves represented they aren’t going to give two craps about how much shadow recovery is in that tree bark.
It’s more important to me that the usability, interface, lens selection and colour output is there than the amount of dynamic range there is and how far I can unscrew the photos I screwed up.
Am I happy with my purchase? Absolutely.
As with all my reviews I make available a massive amount of raw files to download.
Below is the opportunity to download 191 raw files consisting of:
- 102 raw files from 4 weddings
- 89 files of which are made up of ISO ranges 100, 400, 800, 1600, 3200, 6400 and 12800 from the following cameras: Canon 5DSr, 5D3, 1DX, A7ii and the Pentax 645z. Also included is a selection of ISO100, 400 and 800 where the images were underexposed on purpose by 4 stops.
These images are also ‘warts and all’ and I’ve done my best to give you under exposed, over exposed and tricky focus situations. In order to ensure compatibility with software across machines (like Lightroom 5) I’ve converted the raws to uncompressed, lossless DNG format so you should have no problem looking at them regardless of your setup.
by Chris Giles Photgoraphy
In total the file sizes collectively run in at 8.7GB and I can’t offer this for free (sorry guys but the host needs paying).
Payment is only available by Paypal, my address for payment is studio@chrisgilesphotography.com
The cost is 5 GBP and once payment is received the download link will be sent to the email address registered to your Paypal account. This is a manual process and I’ll send the files ASAP.
Have fun with these files but please respect the copyright on them. I hope it helps you to make a decision over which camera is best for you!
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great summary Chris – a lovely insight into your usage and cuts through a lot of the BS you read around on the internet.
I’m still sticking with SoNikon though 🙂
Thanks for a great and photography oriented review. We see too many pixle peeping, chart porn reviews. I got one of the first 5DSR bodies delivered here in Norway and, even though I am not a professional like you, my experiences with it are the same. I was very critical when they released the spec, but pleasantly surprised when I got the first files up on the screen.
I´ll keep my 1DX for wildlife, birds and action shooting, but the 5DIII is now in the hands of a happy son.
Great review. I decided to order the A7rii instead of this camera. I’ve been very impressed with images I’ve seen from the other Sony mirrorless cameras. And the A7Rii quieter shutter is supposedly rated at a 500,000 shot shutter rating. Already a 5Diii owner I figured I’d try something new. But your review has me second guessing (just a little).
I’m hoping the Sony and my Zeiss lenses create some kind of magic but, if not, it’s good to know the 5DSr is performing great. Thanks again for the real world review.
Great review.
Tank you so much
I’m dipping my toes in the sony pool after 21 years of Canons. I shoot about 70 weddings and 70 family pics a year so my biggest fear is can the cute little sony body take the abuse I dish out on my canons. We’ll see same time next year.
If you convert the raw files to DNG, they cannot be used with Capture One Pro, since that app has no profiles for converted DNGs. The results look like crap.
That’s Capture one for you. The Pentax 645z files (Native or DNG) won’t work either. They also lock out Hasselblad which is why I’ll never use C1. Unfortunately that’s Phase One being Phase One, however you can get a free trial of Lightroom here: http://prodesigntools.com/adobe-lightroom-6-cc-direct-download-links.html – I recommend using Lightroom 5 though if you can find it.
So even if you had the 5DS CR2’s you wouldn’t be able to read the 645z ones anyway.
I tried to make these files as mainstream as possible for (most) users, unfortunately Capture One is an issue but like, screw Phase for blocking out other manufacturers and formats.
This is a really interesting review Chris, real world reviews are always much more meaningful that lab data (although lab data does have its place too).
The 5DSR is not a body that I personally will be getting . . . holding fire for the 5DmkIV (or whatever it will be called). However it looks like Canon is / should be closing the gap in sensor tech to Sony.
I also have another question . . . I found the link for your review from http://www.canonwatch.com but if I look at your blog for other gear reviews the posts do not show up. Do you have a alternative blog to your main one for gear reviews?
Hi Simon, I only have this and the Pentax 645z review currently. I’m taking delivery of the Sigma 24-35 F2 tomorrow though and should have a review ready by next weekend or the week after. It’s difficult balancing work and writing time in August with what I do!
There’s the search option at the top of the blog for the 645z review 🙂
You say MRAW is compressed – isn’t RAW (losslessly) compressed too? Or are you saying that MRAW is compressed using a lossy algorithm? I’m of the camp that compression is a good thing, but lossy compression is bad. Do you agree, or is compression (even lossless) causing you issues somehow?
Hi Pete,
Full size Raw is uncompressed. When making Mraw Canon doesn’t pixel bin which would be lossless. Instead it downsamples the original file losing bits of data along the way, so say 14 bit down to 11 bit. Those figures aren’t exact and are just as a guide. There’s a lot of examples online about how Mraw is compressed. Mraw is convenience at a cost so isn’t something I would personally want to compromise on. I don’t know why Canon does it this way or why they don’t give us to ability to make the choice for ourselves.
Hi Chris,
Very interesting review. Have you noticed any difference in metering compared to the 5d3? I tend to shoot in aperture mode and find the 5d3 can be a bit random at times and it still takes me by surprise compared to my days shooting a d700 some years ago.
Have been considering a d750 but don’t really want to switch again, although the d750 files are certainly less noisy than the 5d3 and the autofocus better in low light.
Thanks,
Cal
Hi Chris,
Thank you for such a wonderful and very practical review.
I absolutely agree with you on the ‘dynamic range’ opinion and comments you made.
Regards.
this is the best real life review of the 5ds(r) i have read, im tired of hearing about dr and pixelpeeping from reviewers of people that havent shot with the camera so it was fun to read from a guy that knows whats important and whats not..thanks
Very nice review – I followed the link from POTN. I just recently purchased my 2nd 5DSR and dumped my 5D3s before they drop further with the coming 1Dx and 5D4 (if it ever comes). I thought your review was spot on – my only slight difference of opinion was how important I think IS lenses are on this camera – in fact I stopped using my 24-70 F2.8 II and 85L and 135L because there was no point in generating such huge files that had no more detail than the 5D3 at 1/60. For non IS lenses I use 1 /4xFL as my rule of thumb after much testing. Because of this, I actually purchased the Sigma 24-105 F4 IS which is a perfect match to the camera and just last week, the new 35L II – that is a wow lens on this camera – sharp across the frame at F1.4 and 1/125, F1.4 Auto ISO works in any lighting. Great review.
Great review man. I’m also a wedding photographer in Melbourne, Au. I’m looking to buy the 5DSR for the highest resolution possible when taking photos of the brides dress detail etc, but will hate it if I get moire. I know you’ve stated you haven’t come across any moire, but since this review have you? Cheers
I had one case of moire and that’s it. I hear it a lot from people but the reality is that sensors with 20 or so megapixels are more likely to get it even with an AA filter on 🙂
Great review of a great camera…..its great I’ve got one!!
One of the best camera reviews I have read, very well rounded and focused on the real world issues. Not many people seem to manage this.
Agree with many of the above, excellent review of this stunning camera, which i am about to order tomorrow i guess, why not? 🙂 I wish the “HandHoldability” would have been mentioned, however i assume it was ok as not all Wedding shots are mounted, but if anyone can comment in a real world situation what it’s like, then please let me know.
Hi Andy, I don’t use a tripod at my weddings (unless it’s some fancy strobist work) 🙂
I downloaded your raw-files and have put them through intense scrutiny. I’m blown away by the quality straight from camera. Colors are freakin’ awesome. ISO..get out of here.. wow. Thank you so much.
For someone in doubt this is a valuable service. And a marvelous write up.
Very good summary and excellent photos. I am not a wedding photographer but I do quite a bit of event photography. I use both the 5D3 and the 5DSr. Your point about the moire is particularly important I have been very pleasantly surprised at the lack of moire with the 5DSr, relative to the 5D3. Herringbone jackets? – no problem.
Mr Giles,
Thank you so much for this review! I have a question for you and do apologize in advance if this was already addressed in your forums.
I am typically a fashion/product photographer I mostly shoot at low iso and finding myself to be printing (ultra print size) more often.
For some time now I have been considering getting a medium format system not only for prints but also to get a “medium format” look. Currently I have the option to choose between an older hasselblad h4d-50 ccd or a pentax 645z.
I do understand the differences between the ccd vs cmos and color tonality is important to me. I was hoping to get your opinion on these systems if possible. Would I be making a great choice with the pentax 645z? Or would the hasselblad with the ccd back and the HC len(s) will have some advantage?
If you are able to offer some insight I would truly be grateful.
Thank you again!
Ian
Hi Ian!
The 645z is much better all round and is more flexible. The Hassy CCD H series bodies are very limited relative to the 645z.
Thanks for the reply.
Good review. It’s good to hear someone review this camera in a shooting environment rather than studio scenes with peepers rambling on about things that do not actually matter.
Thank you
Hi, really enjoyed your review.
Just wondering, what lens would you recommend best for weddings as well as landscape and portrait shoots for the 5DSR?
Thanks.
Hi Nellie, whatever lens suits your shooting style. I’ve moved more towards primes lately but something like the 24-70 mkii is a lens I feel is essential as it can do so much, and well too.
Other than this a fast 35 and 85 are handy. The L series versions have the edge but the 35mm F2 IS is very nice as well.
One thing that baffled me initially was that I found zooming 100% on the screen was giving me blurry pics, until I eventually realised this was because I was recording RAW and small jpg (for quick sharing of unedited shots) and the review was set to use the jpg. No idea how that happened but mention in case it baffled anyone else.
It does offer a sort of solution to one of your quibbles though, that of review time, you could deliberately set it up to show a small jpg, (and just not import them). Not ideal but…
thanks for the review
🙂
Hey Chris
If you just knew how many crappy forums, articles and shit I have read about this beast… Oh man… I am so freaking happy reading your outstanding review..
You are so cool and your pics are awesome.
The way you think photography about the ISO, DR and so is in my opinion so true and logic.
I had the Nikon d810 before I had it all stolen in the middle of the night in our house… Very uncomfortable and especially for my wife and kids..
Well… I definitely know now what I have to order.
Pretty exiting learning the Canon system.
Thank you Chris for the awesome article.
Yours sincerely
Morten
Hey Chris
Now when the Mark IV is in place are you still of the opinion that this 5dsr has the benefits of the sensor.
I am so much in doubt which I shall buy.
Hi Morten, thanks for your comments and kind words.
Absolutely the 5DSr has it’s place. As much as I love the 5D4 all it’s done is drive a wedge between the type of use the cameras are good for. The 5D4 is a better wedding cam, but for portraits, controlled lighting and Landscpaes the 5DSr still wins or at worst is neck and neck
The 5DSr has the flatter output though which may suit people better if they like to puch files. There really isn’t a clear winner between the two both have their merits.
Thanks for the excellent review.
I have a 5Ds, replacing my 5D III. Two things I noticed that you don’t mention are that the white balance algorithms seem much better and the camera produces fantastic 22Mpixel JPEGs. Of course this is subjective but for me as an amateur photographer these improvements seem to be rarely mentioned by reviewers.
Fantastic camera.
Hi Ian, this is true. They really nailed the white balance although I’ll also add it’s even better on the 5Div, no more WB nightmares from the 1DSiii era!
Chris-
If the Pentex 645Z was the same exact price as the Canon 5DSR, and had the same ammount of lens offerings, and someone put a gun to your head and you had to choose only one, which one would you choose.
I have owned the 5DSr and then sold it and purchased the 5d iv. I sometimes miss the cabablity of the 5DSr for cropping, and just the overall sharpness of the camera. Don’t get me wrong, the 5D iv is great in it’s own right, dynamic range is nice, wifi is nice. I shoot mostly portraiture and I am waiting and hoping and saving to someday purchase medium format camera system, and after reading your review, and many others reviews of the Pentex and the Fuji, I think that the Pentex would be the one I would purchase. I would also keep my 5d iv too and use them together.
For shooting, i currently shoot with canon 85F1.2 ii, canon 35mm F1.4, and Tamaron 70-200mm G2. I use the 85mm 90% of the time and shoot AF in AV mode. I typically do not shoot full manual, but have in the past, and could get used to it i suppose with practice.
Thanks for such great reviews!
Mike Montville
Hi Chris – are you still shooting primarily with the 5Dsr or have moved to something else in it’s place?